The Therapy Business Podcast
We know how challenging growing a therapy practice can be, and don’t think it should require an accounting degree just to run your business. If you own a solo or a group practice, we’re here to help you build a business that creates more time, makes more money and serves more people.
The Therapy Business Podcast
The Power of Knowing Your Numbers with Gretchen Roberts
Curious about how accurate bookkeeping can transform your therapy practice? Join us for an insightful conversation with Gretchen Roberts from Red Bike Advisors as she shares her journey from marketing to accounting and the pivotal role clean financial records play in scaling a business.
Gretchen provides invaluable insights into how understanding your numbers can help you uncover hidden financial issues, save money, and make strategic decisions like hiring new staff. This discussion is not just for bookkeepers but for anyone looking to elevate their practice through sound financial management.
Explore the power of outsourcing with our deep dive into why delegating bookkeeping tasks can lead to significant business growth. Gretchen emphasizes the importance of recognizing your strengths and knowing when to hand off tasks to professionals, allowing you to focus on high-level strategy and growth.
Gretchen's Website: https://redbikeadvisors.com/
Book a call with Gretchen: https://redbikeadvisors.com/book-a-free-strategy-session/
Our Profit Coaching program is enrolling new practices now.
We specialize in helping therapy practices like yours achieve financial clarity, so you can focus on what you do best—helping your clients and managing your team- while we help handle all the businessy stuff they didn’t teach you in grad school.
To see if your practice might be a good fit, schedule a free consultation at therapybusinesspod.com.
Meet with one of our coaches
*Intro/outro song credit:
King Around Here by Alex Grohl
Having clean books is so important when it comes to a therapy practice and yet I mean, if you're like me, it's one of those things that maybe got neglected or is still getting neglected. I know, for a long time in my business it was something I was trying to manage on my own and doing a terrible job of. Well, today, gretchen Roberts, with Red Bike Advisors, joins us to talk about the importance of bookkeeping, the importance of having organized numbers and how it can help you scale your practice. My name is Craig and I'm the CEO of Desi Financial Coaching. Our goal is simple to help you run a therapy practice that is permanently profitable. If you own a solo or group practice, we're here to help you build a business that creates more time, makes more money and serves more people. This is the Therapy Business Podcast. All right, we have Gretchen here. Gretchen, how are you doing?
Speaker 2:I'm great. How are you, Craig?
Speaker 1:I'm awesome. Thank you so much for being here to talk about bookkeeping. Now, people who are listening okay, I know bookkeeping sometimes can seem like a topic. You're like, oh my gosh, do I want to hear about bookkeeping? Now, people who are listening okay, I know bookkeeping sometimes can seem like a topic like oh my gosh, do I want to hear about bookkeeping? But I promise you you do, because it's super valuable and I truly believe it can save you tons and tons of money in your business, because there's probably a lot of things under the surface that you don't even know is there. Would you agree with that?
Speaker 2:I would totally agree with that, and I should actually start off by admitting that I myself am not a bookkeeper, I am a business owner and so you know, like pretty much probably your whole audience, I don't actually go into my QuickBooks all the time and I don't mess around in there, right, but I do understand that there's that, that having clean books is super important for every business owner because you need to know your numbers. So you know, before people make the assumption that I'm the nerdy person in there categorizing the transactions, I'm actually not, but I'm actually a huge advocate of doing that. So we can talk more about that.
Speaker 1:Love it. Yeah, and what's what's fun too? I mean, I'm so. I'm part of the profit first organization and every year we go to this conference and it's you know, I'm one of the few coaches there. Most of them are accountants and bookkeepers, and they're a fun group of people. You would you'd be surprised how fun. Uh, what you would just assume are numbers, people who are quiet and introverted. No, that's, that's I've learned, is not the case. We all have assumptions that are clearly wrong and so, yeah, so, Gretchen, tell us a little bit about you, what? What? Tell us about your business, what you do, and, yeah, a little bit about yourself.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I'm the CEO of Red Bike Advisors and we are an accounting, bookkeeping, tax strategy planning and filing firm and we also do fraud and forensic accounting, which is kind of cool. And we do tax resolution, for we call that the medic side of the business, you know so when people don't pay their taxes or if they get into any kind of financial trouble, we've got you on that side too. So we are based in Wilmington, north Carolina, but we serve clients mostly small business owners all over the US, a lot of service businesses such as therapy consultants or therapy businesses. We do a lot of dentists, so a lot in the medical space.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, that's great, that's great. And so how did you get started in this industry? Have you always, because you kind of alluded to at the beginning that you're not really the numbers is maybe not where isn't what you fell in love with, is that right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so it's actually an interesting little origin story. I actually have a marketing and sales background.
Speaker 2:And I was working in corporate America as a director of customer marketing and I had a little midlife crisis last year and I bought an accounting firm. So I felt like my skill set was somewhat transferable and I really love this business because I've always been a numbers person. Again, I'm not a bookkeeper, I'm not in there doing my own books, but I love to pull my reports and analyze how my business is doing. I really believe in the idea of knowing your numbers as a business owner to help you make strategic decisions and to grow, and even things like can I afford to hire somebody? There's a lot of questions that business owners have and it always is going to end up boiling down to the numbers and if you don't know your numbers, it's really hard to make those decisions. So, yeah, I ended up in accounting in sort of a circuitous way, but I'm really. It's a lot of fun. It's a lot more fun than it sounds to your point.
Speaker 1:I bet Well and you know that's I might have to pick your brain too at some point, because that's something I've shied away from, even what we offer, Cause I have. I personally have zero interest in bookkeeping, uh, learning it, Cause that's just not. Uh, we're. Again, I'm very similar to you. That's not my headspace, I'm not, uh, that's not where I thrive. But you know, we, we've always thought about maybe we somehow serve our clients in that capacity, but I'm like I don't want to have to learn bookkeeping and manage a team on it. So clearly you can do it without being a bookkeeper, which is amazing. So I think that's great and it's similar to you. Know, these therapy practice owners, although they know the craft of providing therapy, really their role is shifting into this I'm going to run the business and do less of the therapy and less of the day-to-day work, and so having that business mindset gives you that leg up, versus if you were an accountant who's trying to learn how to run the business, you get to come in kind of the opposite. Is that right?
Speaker 2:Yeah, for sure. I think you know a lot of accounting firms will be founded by somebody who is a CPA or they're a trained accountant, and then they have to learn the business side, and I think that's very similar to therapy, right? So you start as a therapist and then you decide to go out on your own. We actually have a couple of clients like that and now they're going. Now I have HR and IT and cybersecurity and accounting and bookkeeping, and so you know there are certain places where you just have to go. You know what I don't. I don't really know this to the depth. I need you to be um, you know to, to be effective at it, um, and there are certain things I outsource to, like I don't do my own it, um, and and I don't do my own bookkeeping either. You know to that point, and so I think, as a business owner, you just have to understand what are my strengths and weaknesses.
Speaker 2:We do have several medical and dental clients who they kind of enjoy doing the books is like their little 9pm hobby, but most of them just don't want to be bothered with it, right, and so you just have to understand which category you fit into, and then you know you have to make time and space and put in your budget the things that you really are not good at, so you can leverage your time on the things you are good at.
Speaker 1:That's so true.
Speaker 1:And you know, I did my own books for years, and not well, and it's simply because I was being probably cheap or trying to cut costs. I mean, that's what we are always trying to do is find where we can balance that. That's what we are always trying to do is find where we can balance that. Um and then, but I, every year around tax time I would spend probably I would have to dedicate a whole day to cleaning up the mess that I had made all year when I wasn't doing a great job of keeping up with it and reconciling a whole year's worth of accounts, cause I was lazy and just didn't do it during the year. So this year is the first time I've outsourced the bookkeeping and it's been just amazing not having to deal with that. And I think that's there's. I can focus my energy elsewhere and it's been such a great investment for me to put in. And then to your point now I can go in and look at the numbers and I know that they're more accurate than when I was doing them.
Speaker 1:And I have more clarity on the numbers when I'm not in there doing the bookkeeping myself versus, which seems kind of counterintuitive. But is that what you typically see? People are like oh, this is so much better, I got a much better understanding what's happening.
Speaker 2:So there's, there's a couple things in what you said. So the first thing I'd say is there is a moment in time in your business when you should be doing that yourself, and the reason for that is you need to understand your income and expenses at that super granular level, right, and that's typically when you're starting off and you're building something from scratch. But then there does come this sort of inflection point where it's like this is not really the highest and best use of my time. It's like I'm still cleaning toilets and I should be bringing in new customers or whatever, right? So, um, so, as an example, you know, I I have a large well, I mean, large is relative, right but I have a fairly large accounting firm that I'm running. We have 18 staff members, and so I'm not doing my own books in the accounting firm, but I do own two rentals and I do profit first on those and I do my own books for those.
Speaker 2:And I have to say, when the 10th and the 25th of the month roll around and I'm doing my books for those two properties, I'm always like ugh, I don't enjoy it. But those properties don't really make enough money for me to fob that off right, they're just rentals and so I just have to deal with it. But there's some point where your business gets big enough that it is worthwhile to hand it off, and then I do think there's some magic that happens where all of a sudden you're in the weeds. Let's use the forest and trees right. You're in all the trees. But then all of a sudden you're at the 10,000-foot view and you can start running your P&L and looking for patterns, and you can run your balance sheet and see how it's changing over time as you pay off loans or add assets or whatever's going on in your company, and you can look at your cash flow reports and start doing a little bit of forecasting.
Speaker 1:And.
Speaker 2:I know that probably sounds really weird and scary, because a lot of people don't even know how to look at their P&L, but I think that's something that your accountant can help you with. We do a thing called know your numbers monthly reporting, and we'll send the reports out. But we always try to pull something out and say, hey, we noticed this or you're trending this way. We'll do meetings with people to help them understand where they're at and where they're heading. And I'm going to say one thing, though there's a lot of people that are interested even in that.
Speaker 2:I literally just got an email from a client. There was a bug in QuickBooks and her billing got shut off, and I spent a long time on the phone trying to get that fixed today. And I emailed her and I said I'm so sorry, there's a bug, they have a case open. And she's like, oh, I don't care, I've never been in my QuickBooks. She's like that's for you guys, she's like that's for you guys. And it just kind of made me laugh and I went you know, um, I think that there's there's definitely a percentage of business owners who probably just open their bank account every day on their mobile phone and they check their bank balance and they're like, oh cool, I have enough money to make payroll this week and that's kind of the end of it, um, and you know that's, you can get by with that for a while. But if you're serious about running a business and growing and creating an asset that is eventually sellable, you do want to have a finer point on it than just checking your bank balance every day 100% agree with that.
Speaker 1:And you know we, we with what we do with our clients. It's kind of that balance and since we don't do the bookkeeping, we always say the books and your P&Ls and all your accounting documents are really a reflection of what's been happening in your business. So it's a great snapshot and it can help you predict what's going to happen. And then the bank account and Profit First, and using those and leveraging those is really for the day to day, how making those small decisions. But that doesn't mean we ignore the big picture. And you know, with our clients we're every quarter.
Speaker 1:So we're looking at here's what percentages we're doing with your bank accounts. Let's look at your P and L and C is is your spending matching what we're doing? Are we ahead of the curve? Are we behind the curve? And so I I think it's, it's a both and it's not an either or it's. You have to have a day-to-day management system and you have to be on top of your numbers and have some good reporting, especially when tax time comes around, which I know, that's what you do too, and have you ever had to deal with clients who have messy books when it's time to file their taxes or have just terrible organized numbers?
Speaker 2:Yeah, we deal with that quite a bit actually, and a lot of times they don't even know it because maybe they're doing it themselves or they have an office manager or something like that and so they think they're being done. But the reality is, when you're doing them yourself or you have somebody in your office doing it, they're not really trained right and so maybe they're classifying transactions. But most of the time we find and I've talked to other accounting firms about this and I think the rule of thumb is something like 80 to 90% of books are just really not where they need to be right, and whether that is that you know they're coming to us and we're taking them over, we usually have a pretty significant cleanup job to do. A lot of times things are wrong on the balance sheet and those have to be corrected. They just haven't been logged correctly or logged at all. And just a couple of examples there that might relate to your audiences. Let's say you have a therapy practice and then you buy a building. That may be done in a separate LLC, which we would recommend, but if you do it under the practice, then you know sometimes that just doesn't even get put in the books because you're doing your own books and you have no idea that you have to record that, right. So so just little things like that.
Speaker 2:So so yeah, at tax time what ends up happening is we do sort of the accountant scramble and we do what's called tax to books and we make all these adjustments to get it to a place where we can get the tax return done. But that doesn't mean the person has a clean and clear view of what's going on in their business. It means we were able to complete the tax return in a way that would pass the IRS, so to speak. Right, so we have everything majorly categorized etc. And so we have all those major questions answered.
Speaker 2:And if there are things that we don't, we can't categorize or we can't identify, we just we won't let the I mean the client cannot take them as deductions. Basically, right, so they're losing out at tax time if they're not properly categorizing things ahead of time. And I don't know about you, but you know, just the other day my husband's like oh, we need to sit down and go over the Venmo account and I need to know what all that stuff was you bought. I'm like that was months ago, I don't remember any of that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's the same in business. You do it once a month, it's not too bad, but if you do it once a year, nobody remembers what they did in March. No. And so then it's like, well, if we can't figure out where that goes, we can't really put it as a deductible expense. So it really is better to keep up all year on the tax side.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that makes complete sense. And I've been there, like I was saying, when I was doing my own and it'd be the end of the year and I was dedicating that whole day, I was going through Amazon orders because I'm going I don't remember what I ordered on Amazon, that was $52.78. Or sometimes the vendor would come in with just an acronym and I'm going what is that place? And come to find out. It's from when I traveled for business to Kansas city and it's this random you know spot or whatever hotel, something.
Speaker 1:So I get that, yeah, but if you're doing it in a more timely manner, it's going to get, make your life easier, get things categorized more easily as well, and so, on that note, cause I'm, I I'm seeing that that's mistakes that I made. And and when therapists go through grad school, no one teaches them this stuff. No one says here's what to do when you, if you decide to buy a building one day, or here's how to manage your own books, or here's how to do these things. So what are some common things you see among business owners? Some mistakes they're making, um, maybe, or even misconceptions that you see when they come in to to meet with you before they hire before they hire you to help them out.
Speaker 2:I think the biggest one is honestly I don't know if it's a mistake, so much it's what we all do is you're just bootstrapping, maybe for too long, right? So I just had a conversation with one of our dental clients, because their books are basically an atrocious mess, and of course they don't think they are, and so I told him you know, look, we had to spend this much time to get it just ready for tax. And here's the thing though you know everything that's coming out of my mouth right now like clients don't care, business owners don't care if their books are clean, they don't care how hard the tax return is to put together, so I can talk about mistakes they're making from this inside baseball point of view. It's so important to have those clean books because if you don't have them, you can't make future forward financial decisions, things that you can do with Profit First, for example and you can't take advantage of all the tax deductions that are available to you, right? So there's two money-saving reasons to have clean, up-to-date books, but most clients don't really place a premium on that.
Speaker 2:They kind of think of it as like this is something I have to do, and so I'm going to sort of do it at this lower level and kind of get by, but it's not something I'm going to sort of do it, you know, at this lower level and kind of get by, but it's not something I'm spending time or money on, because you know they're busy, like there's so many directions a business owner gets pulled in right and so this is never at the top of their list. You know, when we send business owners the it's called ask my accountant. It's like the spreadsheet of I don't know how to classify these transactions, like from from that random Kansas city travel trip you took. They just they don't. You know, at the end of the day, like they've been seeing patients all day and the last thing they want to do is sit down at their desk and be like, oh, I'm going to classify all my transactions now.
Speaker 1:Right, right.
Speaker 2:And so. So I think that's kind of a big one. But but I guess, like if I back way out and say, what is the biggest mistake? Um, it's probably not those little things, I think it's. I think it's the idea that, um, finance is a primary driver of business.
Speaker 2:And, to your point, a lot of people who go to professional school are not trained in finance at all at all, and so they they don't even, they might not even know what a balance sheet is. You know, or how to read it, and that's okay. But, um, you know, if you're going to be a business owner, you have to. You have to say, okay, I'm not going to do my own bookkeeping, I'm not going to do my own taxes, Um, I'm not going to do my own it, and I could name some other ones that people don't want to do. But you do have to say I need a working knowledge of this to be a better business owner and to make my business sustainable. And if I think about the number one thing that would make a business sustainable, besides sales and marketing, it's having a really good grasp on your finances.
Speaker 1:Yes, and you're right. No, most people don't and I. It's a vulnerable thing too, it's. We get it a lot where people are almost embarrassed and that can sometimes prevent them from starting. I felt that way before going. I was, you know, I had close friends who are bookkeepers through the Profit First organization, who I was connected with, who would offer to help me with my books. I'm like I don't want you seeing what a mess it is. It's embarrassing because you know I work with people on their finances and mine is just an unorganized mess. So, business owners, I think it's. It's a vulnerable thing to come and say here, look at my numbers, dissect it. But I do agree. I think that people are missing out on just growth opportunities when you don't know what's going on with the finances. It's so important.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I do think there's sort of two buckets of people right, and I'm a member of an accounting association, like a professional association, and I was leading some marketing workshops for them, because that's my background, and we were talking about how to market, to get clients and and we were talking about you know what percentage of people that are that you bring on for bookkeeping and talks like really care and they want to meet with you every month and they're super interested in it, and we decided it's probably like 20%, maybe 80%, just they, they don't. It is sort of a compliance thing. They're just like get it done, just they don't. It is sort of a compliance thing. They're just like get it done Don't don't bother me, right and that's fine.
Speaker 2:You know it's it's, it's fine. That's fine too, because it still does need to be done. Right, and even going back to like, if you have a real, a real business it's an S corp or a partnership or a C corp you have to have a formal set of books. It's required by the IRS in order to do your tax return right. You can get away with less if you have just a pass-through LLC that goes on your individual return. That's a Schedule C, so you don't necessarily have to have all the same stuff. But for the business tax returns, the IRS does require more right, and so you do have to comply from that perspective. And if all people want us, compliance does require more right, and so you do have to comply from that perspective. And if all people want is compliance, that's okay. Right, because we're still providing them a service they can't or shouldn't or don't want to do themselves.
Speaker 2:And that other 20%, that's where it's a lot of fun. I think that's where you play. You know, I love working with business owners who are excited to grow and who want to understand their KPIs in relation to other others in their industry, benchmarking how they're performing and asking big questions like should I acquire this adjacent facility, should I hire this key employee and what's the right timing for that? You know, should I make this investment in sales and marketing? So I love working with people who have those questions and we can look at the numbers to help them answer them.
Speaker 1:Yes, that's, that's the type of people we work with. Like you're talking about, that's the playground, that's that's fun. And you know with, like you were talking about, that's the playground, that's fun, and you know we have. Since we don't offer the bookkeeping, we do have a lot of people who are getting that stuff done for the compliance reasons and then likely their bookkeeping and accountant don't offer that advisory side of things, and so that's where they come to us and we can take the data that their bookkeeper and advisor are doing and then do what you're just talking about have some fun with strategizing and and using that money to leverage that growth. So I think it's great that you're doing that as well with your clients and offering that, and I wish more would take advantage of it, because I think that there's just so much value in that there's not many people speaking into their business through that lens of profitability and through that lens of finances.
Speaker 1:There's probably. They're probably hiring consultants and coaches who are saying grow, grow, grow, and you know that's all they care about is the growth metrics. But there's a whole other side of it is how to do it in a financially healthy and wise and smart way.
Speaker 2:Yeah, for sure. I mean, you know, there it's easy to grow your revenue, but you have to. You have to always look at the bottom line. I mean, if you're a business owner, what are you in this for Right? I hate. I hate when I talk to business owners and they're like oh, I never pay myself. Or you know, I do pay myself, but I pay myself like 30,000 a year.
Speaker 2:And it's like what do you? What are you doing? You're probably working 80 hours. You deserve more than that. You're taking all the risk on. You have that burden that 2 am burden that nobody else has, and you deserve to be well compensated for that. And if you're not, you need some kind of numbers detective to help you figure out how to get there. And I think that's one of the principles of profit first that, I think, is it's probably one that I mean. There's a lot of great things about profit first, but I think my number one is that takeaway of as the business owner. You need to be paying yourself a decent amount of money, and you may not be able to right away, but that's what that's. The first goal you need to work toward is paying yourself, yeah yep, I.
Speaker 1:That's. What we resonate with the most, too, is that the business should support your lifestyle, and that's that's what we are big believers in. Yes, under the hood, there is this more moral reason that we are doing that. We love to help people.
Speaker 1:Therapists are wanting to make an impact on their community and help people, but truthfully and this is us to helping people with their finances. That's our passion. We want to help people change that. But I could go work for somebody else and do that and make a good salary. The reason I started a business was because I wanted control over my income and my time, and as business owners, we just fall into that trap where we are working long hours and making way less and treating ourselves way worse than we would ever accept from any other boss, and so I think it's an easy trap to fall into and a hard one to know how to get out of if you don't have control of your numbers, like you were just saying.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I mean, I think you're right about therapists in particular. There's a lot of people who go into something because it's a true vocation, right, and you know, you know, for us, like we think of our mission is, our mission is to help our small business clients create value, and I think of it as a whole ecosystem. Right, so it's the small business owner, but they're growing the value of their business. Right, so it's the small business owner, but they're growing the value of their business. That, in turn, helps their customers and clients. They're part of their vendors, are part of their ecosystem, getting value as well. Their employees are getting value from the business and ultimately, it should be an asset, a legacy that they can leave to their family.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And so you know, like that's why I show up to work every day. It's not, it's not to make money, but to your point, yeah, or you can think of yourself as a CPA or whatever you are. But if you are running a business you have to first put on that business owner hat and say what are we doing for our ecosystem, what's our why right? And then that has to also involve you and your family 100%, completely agree, and it's not selfish.
Speaker 1:There's nothing wrong with wanting those things and to prioritize those things, and I think that water can get muddied in the therapy world Because we that's just at their core they typically a therapist. It has a compassionate heart for others and one to put others first and forgetting that it's okay to be profitable and to make money doing something and to charge your value and do all those things. And so so, gretchen, if somebody, if there's a therapist out there listening who has their spreadsheet they have an Excel sheet with a few of their expenses they don't have a bookkeeping software, they've never managed it and they're this is resonating and they're thinking, okay, I have to get, I need to start doing something to get this organized so I can get some clarity. What do you? What would you recommend being the first step in, in getting stuff together and getting organized?
Speaker 2:Um, yeah, so we, we actually are bringing on a new client that has been operating for three years and they don't have any books at all, and so we're literally starting them from scratch. Um, and they don't have any books at all, and so we're literally starting them from scratch. So it's a lot to reconstruct three or four years of books from scratch. Yeah, but I think the way I'd answer that is to say you need to get clarity on what you want. You need to get clarity on what you want, right? So if you're a business and you're finally a business return, then you really do need to get into software so you can have the trifecta. It's the P&L, the balance sheet and the cash flow report, and you need those three things for tax time.
Speaker 2:But again, I don't think tax time is even the most important thing. So the way we talk about it is we think of it as a pyramid, and at the bottom of the pyramid is clean books and you have to have those to build on that with money saving tax strategy, and then you can further build on that with financial advisory, such as profit first advisory, cashflow forecasting, things like that. So, um, so the starting point is really to get into a software like QuickBooks. Um, that's the one we use, but there are other ones. Um, I think you know, like there's zero and there's. I think some people use wave, so it just depends on what you're comfortable with.
Speaker 2:If you want to try it yourself, um, you know. But if, if yourself, but if you feel like you're at the point where your practice is, it's past the point where you want to personally be sitting there at your desk at 9pm on a Thursday classifying your transactions, then just hire somebody. Right? It's just like I would not do my own therapy I would hire one of you. There are certain things that only pros can do, right, so you just have to recognize where you're at in your journey and then make your decision. Am I going to try to do this myself? The advantage to doing it yourself is that you do get a really intimate view of things that you probably haven't looked at in a long time, like what am I really spending on stuff? Right, and there are some advantages to that to you know, paying your bills and classifying everything and really understanding where your money's going, but at some point that's not where your time should go.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I agree, I agree. Well, there's people out there listening, I'm sure, who are wanting to take that next step. So how can people get in touch with you if they want either help building that foundation of the pyramid, or maybe they have that and they're just kind of looking for that next level of growth or support or some forensic analysis into their business? How can somebody get in touch with you to work with you and your team?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so we're at redbikeadvisorscom so you can go there and check out our services. There's a free strategy session that we offer. It would be me or one other person in the firm and we'll just we'll kind of get on a call and just listen to. You know what are your business goals, what are you looking for in the next three to five years, or you know where do you want to head, what are your pain points today, and then, um, usually from there we can offer, you know, a suite of services that will help alleviate some of those pain points and help them get to the next level.
Speaker 1:Great. We'll link all that stuff in the show notes so that people can get there and get some help. But I really really appreciate this has been a lot of fun to talk about. See, at the top of the recording I said it's more fun than we think it is to talk about these things and it's not as overwhelming and scary. So I appreciate you making it something that's really digestible and not going over our heads. And, yeah, just thank you for being here.
Speaker 2:Yeah, thank you, craig, it's been great being here.
Speaker 1:Thanks for joining us on the Therapy Business Podcast. Be sure to subscribe, leave a review and share it with a practice owner that you may know. If your practice needs help getting organized with its finances or just growing your practice, head to therapybusinesspodcom to learn how we can help.
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